Now, in doing that I should also like to point out that that Commission, although I do like to boast a little bit about it because I do think it has done such an outstanding job—although it has done this, it has never even owned a vessel, but when we conducted our investigations out at sea, we put our scientists right out on fishing boats. We chartered fish boats and stuck our scientists on fish boats and sent them out like the fishermen go, and they get their information with scientific accuracy, but with great discomfort, but we do get the facts. Our whole program has been based upon the accurate collection of those facts. Having those then we analyze the situation to see what should be done, and we found that if you would hold the catch down to a figure which was just or somewhat under the reproduction or increase ability of this fishery, you could gradually build it up. Senator DUFF. How did you do that? Mr. ALLEN. By our measurements of what you call the potentialities of the fishery, how long those fish live, what the weight is from year to year. Senator MAGNUSON. How do you effect that? Senator DUFF. How did you enforce that regulation? Mr. ALLEN. The way we enforce that regulation is this: We estimate the quantity, the poundage of fish-in January, for instance, of this year, we held our meeting, and we estimated the poundage of fish that we considered could be safely caught and still leave a little margin of gain. We divide the whole fishery into areas, and then we say, "You can catch so many pounds," say 25 million pounds in area 2. Senator DUFF. How do you enforce that regulation? That is what I am getting at. Mr. ALLEN. Then our fisheries' statisticians keep a very close watch on the catch, and in area 2, for instance, this one I am saying with 25 million pounds, more than about 12 days ahead of the time when they believe that 25 million pounds will be caught, they report that to the Commission, and the Commission issues an order saying that 12 days from now the season will be closed. Senator DUFF. You can enforce that under penalties, can you? Mr. ALLEN. Yes. We don't do the enforcement ourselves. The Coast Guard, the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the customs service actually do the enforcement, but we give the regulations. Our statisticians and biologists are so accurate that I think in the history of our Commission-I don't believe they have ever missed over 5 percent in prophesying the date at which that poundage will be caught. It is just a remarkable system of accuracy. Senator DUFF. That makes good sense to me. Under what legal authority is that done? Senator MAGNUSON. This is a joint commission between Canada and the United States, and they participate, too? Mr. ALLEN. Yes, the Commission does consist of two United States Commissioners and two Canadian Commissioners, one from the official Government agencies, for instance, the Fish and Wildlife Service of the United States. Senator DUFF. How long has that been in operation? Mr. ALLEN. The Commission was established in 1924, but its first year of regulation was 1932. Senator DUFF. You have seen a gradual buildup from that time? Mr. ALLEN. There has been a gradual buildup from that time, a steady and gradual-when I say "steady," there has been a steady trend. There have been years when there was a slight fluctuation of successive increase or successive decrease, but over the period of years there has been a steady, gradual increase of that fishery until we believe we have it it very close to the maximum that the banks will stand, and now our problem is to get that maximum. Our very success has been our handicap. The fishery has become so attractive that fishermen have come into it from other fisheries in great numbers, thereby increasing our problem of management and catching this quota in such a short time that it is very much more difficult to have accurate statistics and also, it is difficult to get the maximum for this additional reason, that in some parts of the area the best fishing is in May; some parts in June; some parts in August; and some parts in September; and until the treaty was amended last year, we didn't have the power to have different seasons in the same area. We could just say that this whole area has to be open in, say, spring. Then they catch the quota, and we close it. The result was that some parts of the area were not fished at the right time in order to get the maximum catch, and we are now confronted with that problem of trying to figure out how we can manage that so as to get the maximum catch from every part of the area. Senator DUFF. What does that catch run to now? Mr. ALLEN. A little over 60 million pounds is the annual catch. When we took hold in 1932, the catch in 1931 had been 43 million, and we have now brought it up to in excess of 60 million by a gradual process. Senator DUFF. That is wonderful. Mr. ALLEN. And as I say, the point particularly that I wanted to make, the two points in that connection were that it is based upon factual, scientific, factual information and a long, continuous program. Senator DUFF. Can you refer me to any report on this thing in detail? I would like to read it. Mr. ALLEN. Yes; we have published reports of the work of the Commission, and we would be very glad to Senator DUFF. I would be very anxious to see them. Mr. ALLEN. We would be very glad to furnish those. The next point that I wish to make is in regard to the cooperation which was referred to; I believe Senator Magnuson referred to that. I want to say one other thing on that continuity. The Fish and Wildlife Service has been frequently criticized in the past for not accomplishing things, and I have been one of the critics at times, but frankly, I think they have been up against a handicap that they couldn't do anything about, and that was that they didn't have enough people or enough funds so that they could meet the demands that were being made upon them from all over the country. California would want something and they would have to send the men to California. Massachusetts would want something and they would have to send them there. Alaska the same way, and they couldn't have that continuity which I think is one of the basic reasons for the success of our halibut commission. Senator MAGNUSON. Then on international matters they were never at any policy level. You remember how long it took us to finally get somebody in the State Department at some policy level to make these kinds of good agreements, dealing with ministers of fisheries in other countries? Mr. ALLEN. Senator Magnuson and Senator Saltonstall were 2 of the 3 Senators that went with us to the State Department and finally succeeded in persuading them to establish a fishery division to handle these international aspects. Senator DUFF. That is wonderful work. Mr. ALLEN. The fishing industry was certainly very grateful to both of them for that. Dr. Chapman was the first one to occupy that position. Mr. Harrington is the present occupant, and I might mention that I told Dr. Chapman he should have mentioned that he got his early training from our halibut commission. On this matter of cooperation, there has not always been perfect cooperation, but I would like to say this, that I have been putting in some time discussing the situation with Mr. Farley, and I feel very hopeful of results from the future from his positive assurances of trying to coordinate the fishing activities and cooperate with the various agencies and eliminate any feeling of competition or jealousy, but all try to strive to the same end, and his attitude has been most encouraging, and it is a pleasure to state that because I think it bodes well for the future. The other point that I wished to make was the one that Senator Saltcnstall mentioned about an amendment. I was just a little fearful that a technical construction of the bill as drafted might be that any investigation had to be directly connected with transportaion, and, of course, that would handicap the use of these funds, because it says here "to promote the free flow of domestically produced fishery products in commerce." If you had to apply that criterion to every use of these funds, it might be a limitation that would be most unfortunate, and so that was the basis of my suggestion. Senator MAGNUSON. You think your suggested language clarifies that? Mr. ALLEN. That was the purpose of the language which I suggested, to be sure that we could conduct these various biological investigations that have been mentioned by the Senator himself, and by you, and by all the other witnesses. STATEMENT OF JOHN F. LINEHAN, GENERAL MANAGER, SEAFOOD PRODUCERS ASSOCIATION, NEW BEDFORD, MASS. Mr. LINEHAN. Mr. Chairman, Senator, my name is John F. Linehan, general manager of Seafood Producers Association in New Bedford, Mass. I am also a commissioner in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts to the Atlantic States Marine Fisheries Commission. I am here today representing the sea scallop segment of the fishing industry in the United States. Most of the sea scallops produced by our domestic industry are found in the North Atlantic area, and the industry represents about a $14 million annual payroll. The scallop bed is chiefly located in New Bedford, but there are operations out of Maine, New York, New Jersey, and other Massachusetts ports. The scallop fishery is in dire need of a research program. We in the industry are of the opinion that the scallop beds are being overfished, but we have no evidence to substantiate this opinion. There has never been any research carried on in this fishery and the industry itself has neither the organization nor the facilities to carry on its own program. The necessity for biological research is immediate. In 1953 the ex vessel price of scallops dropped to a level where the boats could no longer operate at a profit. We have lost 25 percent of our scallop fleet in the past year. Some of our boats have gone south; some have been converted to groundfish draggers, and some are tied up to piers because the owners are broke. More efficient methods of operation must be determined. The yield per unit of effort must be increased, and this can come about only through technological research. Only one question will faze us in the near future if the status quo continues. Will the scallop become extinct before the owners go completely broke, or vice versa. Senator DUFF. You are answering that yourself, I assume. Mr. LINEHAN. Well, that is a question in our minds, I think; one or the other will happen if the status quo does remain. Gentlemen, in conclusion, I feel-and those of us in the sea-scallop industry feel that Senate 2802 must be passed and funds made available for research in the scallop fishery so that we may know what steps to take to conserve this industry for the future and what we must do to increase the efficiency of our operations. Thank you very much for your attention. Senator DUFF. Is there any other witness who wishes to be heard? Without objection, I would like to insert in the record at this time a letter which I have received from Mr. Arthur B. Jarrell, of Pennsylvania. (The letter from Arthur B. Jarrell is as follows:) Hon. J. H. DUFF, United States Senate. JARRELL & REA, DEAR SENATOR DUFF: We are informed that hearings will begin soon, before your subcommittee, on the Saltonstall bill, S. 2802. We suggest consideration of an amendment to, or a clause in, this bill that definitely sets forth the percentage of this fund to be allocated to purpose 1 and purpose 2 of the bill. We feel that since this money is to be derived from an almost direct levy upon the market baskets of the American housewife, that the majority of it should be spent in her behalf. This could be done through educational assistance to her in the value of fish and seafoods in the daily diet of ber family. We have long favored the transfer of the administration of the Fisheries from the Department of Agriculture to the Department of Interior. We are very much in favor of the bill provided some safeguard is placed therein whereby we, in the interior of the country, derive benefit therefrom in proportion to the almost 100 percent of the payment thereto. If you think well of this suggestion, any help you may give me in the matter will be greatly appreciated. Sincerely yours, ARTHUR B. JARRELL. Senator DUFF. The record will remain open for 7 days to permit Members of Congress and any other interested person to file statements or other inserts. I wish, on behalf of the committee and the staff, to express our gratitude to Mr. Charles Jackson of the National Fisheries Institute for coordinating the proceedings whereby we have been able to get a great deal of testimony in here in a short time and to make a complete record. I want to say to all of you that, speaking for myself, and I know that Senator Magnuson feels the same way, we have greatly enjoyed holding this hearing, and I am sure that the recommendations of the subcommittee will be for the enactment of the bill, and I haven't the slightest doubt but the general committee will follow that recommendation. (Whereupon, at 4:40 p. m., the hearing was adjourned.) Following are letters and telegrams from the following: Raymond E. Steele, counsel, American Seafood Distribution Association, 917 15th Street NW., Washington, D. C.; Lester Caveny, business agent, A. F. of L. Fish Canneries Union, Monterey, Calif.; E. R. Darling, secretary, Massachusetts Shell Fish Officers Association, Orleans, Mass.; Twin City Fishermen's Cooperative, Morgan City, La.; Congressman Bob Sikes, a Representative in Congress from Florida. WASHINGTON, D. C., March 31, 1954. INTERSTATE AND FOREIGN COMMERCE COMMITTEE, United States Senate, Washington, D. C.: The American Seafood Distributors Association with 163 members in 23 States wishes to go on record as favoring S. 2802. Members of this association are responsible for the distribution of imported as well as domestic fishery products in the United States and they believe that revenue derived from fishery imports should be diverted into channels that will aid consumers of seafood in buying better merchandise at fair prices. While conservation and production problems are vital to the domestic industry, the matter of distribution is also vital. It is the hope of this association that your committee will not only pass favorably on S. 2802 but will recommend in its report that the problems of distribution will not be overlooked in carrying out the word and intent of the bill. RAYMOND E. STEELE, Counsel, American Seafood Distributors Association. MONTEREY, CALIF., March 29, 1954. JOHN W. BRICKER, Chairman, Senate Committee on Intertsate and Foreign Commerce, We respectfully request that you support Senate bill 2802. The fishing industry must have additional research project in order to survive. A. F. OF L. FISH CANNERIES UNION, ORLEANS, MASS., March 29, 1954. CLERK, SENATE COMMITTEE ON INTERSTATE AND FOREIGN COMMERCE, Record Massachusetts Shell Fish Officers Association in favor of 8. 2×02. MORGAN CITY, LA., April 1, 1954. INTERSTATE AND FOREIGN COMMERCE COMMITTEE, United States Senate: We endorse principles S. 2802 and urge its enactment. TWIN CITY FISHERMEN'S COOPERATIVE |